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tv   The Last Word With Lawrence O Donnell  MSNBC  September 22, 2016 7:00pm-8:01pm PDT

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degree manslaughter today. and the pressure is intense for people to see the video themselves and make up their mi minds. the mayor has declared a midnight curfew. they just put out a formal statement of what that curfew is. but they're going to clear the streets between midnight and 6:00 a.m. we'll see how they intend to do that, because there are a rlot people out in the streets of charlotte. >>. as rachel just said, protests are continuing in charlotte, where the mayor has ordered a midnight curfew. today in tulsa, an oklahoma police officer was charged with manslaughter in the shooting of an unarmed black man, terrence krucrutch -- terence crutcher. donald trump and his supporters had a lot to say about what's
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happening in charlotte this week. >> the way we change the system requires being peaceful, being thoughtful. >> how can we lead when we can't even control our own cities. >> three years straight, crime has gone down. >> i would do stop and frisk. i think you have to. we did it in new york. it worked incredibly well. >> bill bratton made clear that stop and frisk was proven not to be effective as a safety tool. that the absence of it allowed us to become safer. >> what we need to do is think about the families of terence crutcher and keith lamont scott. >> we never had problems like this. >> we will bring security. >> let's talk about trump. >> oh, let's. >> when you see how well it works for donald trump, do you ever think to yourself, oh, maybe i should be more racist?
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>> this is the last word on campaign 2016. on friday, tulsa police officer betty shelby fired one shot into the right lung of terrante terrence crutcher. betty shelby's bullet killed terrence crutcher. and video of the shooting outraged people across the country. even donald trump said it looked like a bad shooting to him. on monday, betty shelby was interviewed by a tulsa homicide detective. on tuesday, while the country was still staring in shock at the video of betty shelby killing terrence crutcher, police in north carolina shot and killed keith lamont scott. his family says he was shot while waiting to pick up his son
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from a school bus. police said he was armed with a handgun, and they briefed their lives were in danger. there is nothing illegal about publicly carrying guns. protesters gathered in charlotte. nine people injured. 44 arrested and one man killed. no arrest was made in that shooting. today in tulsa, officer betty shelby was charged with first degree manslaughter. protesters have returned to the streets tonight in charlotte. msnbc national reporter joins us live from charlotte. what is the situation there now? >> reporter: thank you, law representatio lawrence. we heard a chant, "we want the tape, we want the tape." we're in that vacuum where
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information is scant. it's not a hostile crowd. but the people who have come out today want answers. they want the tape. we've been marching for about an hour. we crossed the city jail where inmates inside flickered their lights as protesters chanted. here we are in the epicenter, right outside the omni hotel where a young man was mortally injured yesterday. tonight hundreds are gathered. you take a look at this crowd, we're gathered right here. there's a gentleman here on top of a trash can. moments ago he said we believe in unyou know you know at this. unity, we believe in peace. the mere presence of officers with their riot gear is provocative. right now the crowd is thick.
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the crowd is somewhat emotional. not angry yet. but it's kind of that lull before the possible storm. we'll see. >> tremaine, what was your sense of the crowd's reaction to the announcement of their being a midnight curfew tonight? >> reporter: there was one gentleman who stood about two feet away from me, and he turned from the crowd, and he said if you're scared of police, go home. if you're scared to go home if you're scared, you shouldn't be here. and that's exactly what that young man said. so, again, there wasn'a ripple through the crowd. but folks are aware at 12:00 a.m. the curfew will be enforced. again, as we've seen it city after city, that will be the telltale sign. how will the police move? will they be provocative at all. going back to past incidents in baltimore. because of the police, they ordered all of those young men off of the buses and made them stay in that neighborhood. we saw the response.
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how will police handle this, where you have hundreds so far. now we're a couple hours away from midnight, but there's already a crowd thick, energized. how will they handle this crowd. what think do may very well determine how things play out here tonight. >> msnbc's tremaine lee, we will be checking back with you during the hour. thank you very much, tremaine. we're joined now by mark thompson. the host of "make it plain", on sirius xm radio, and the host of a new pod cast. i want to begin by listening to what president obama said about this today. let's listen to this. >> i think it's important to separate out the pervasive sense of frustration among a hot lot african-americans about shootings of people and justice that is not always colorblind.
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the way we change the system requires us to be able to reach out and engage the broader american community. andhat reqres being peaceful. that requires being thoughtful about what are the specific reforms you're looking for. the overwhelming majority of people who've been concerned about police/community relations, doing it the right way, every once in a while, you see folks doing it the wrong way. >> mark thompson, president obama clearly trying to take down the temperature. >> thank you, lawrence, and i agree with what he said. i would make a friendly amendment to the gentleman in the white house, and that is the way we change the system is to establish local community control and civilian oversight of the police departments and police departments are done locally. that's what needs to be done. but i do think that there's even
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something to this that i hope everyone understands is even more frightening in all of this. i'm losing my mic. en the african-americans in many respects wake up every day, concerned about their lives, concerned about their well-being, frankly, it's only my faith in god that lets me know i may make it home safely every night, but otherwise, we don't know whether we will make it home safely, whether we are actually going to be assaulted by the police. in the case of terrence crutcher, he didn't do anything wrong. in the case of keith lamont scott, allegedly, all he was doing was reading a book. one minute they say he has a gun. the next minute, he doesn't have a gun. then he has a gun. i mean, it keeps going around and around. and, as we are, we want non-violent protests. but dr. king also said the
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so-called riots are the voice of the unheard. we call for peace. we call for non-violent protests. we call fort the measure i just recommended, local civilian control of the police. but by the same token, as irresponsible as it would be for me to say, any of us to say, jonathan or tremaine to say, burn baby burn, is also irresponsible to impose a curfew. that, in and of itself is inciteful. it's irresponsible for donald trump to run around saying stop and frisk. that is inciteful. we didn't even have a curfew last weekend when there was the suspected terrorist in new york. what is the sefrngs nse of a cu the curfews often incite the violence. >> i want to show some of the
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feelings of that community, this is from robert pittinger, one of the local congressman from just outside suburban charlotte. he is a donald trump supporter. let's listen to what congressman pittinger said today in explaining the protesters. >> the grievance is the animus, the anger. they hate white people, because white people are successful, and they are not. yes, it is, it is a welfare state. we have spent trillions of dollars on welfare. but we've put people in bondage so that they can't be all that they're capable of being. >> jonathan capehart, that's that congressman's explanation. they hate white people. >> that's not what's happening here at all. and that tape you just showed just highlights the incredible gulf between that elected member
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of congress and the community he supposedly represents. that clip you showed of president obama, what i thought he was doing there, he's playing a very complicated game, a game not in a pejorative sense. as mark pointed out. police departments are run locally, the president has no control over police departments, so there's only so much he can say. the fact that he talked about peaceful protests, and there's a way to get the session tem yste attention to you. the overwhelming numbers of people out on the streets of charlotte to keep protesting, to keep having their voices heard, acknowledging the fact that there are going to be some knuckleheads who are out there not for the right reasons, but to not let those people and their potentially violent actions discourage them from keeping, making their voices
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heard. and while i know there are people who would like for the president of the united states and this president in particular to go out there and say way more, there are lines he can't cross, legal, constitutional. even rhetorically, that you would like him to, but he's just not going to. so as we watch these pictures out of charlotte. i think we all hope and pray that what happened the night before and the night before that, we don't see that same sort of violence when this curfew, this unbelievable curfew goes into place in a couple of hours. >> congressman pittinger who we just heard say about the protesters, quote, they hate white people, because white people are successful, and they're not. that congressman, hours after at that statement got circulation issued a statement, basically saying he regrets it, didn't apologize for it.
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he said he responded to a reporter's question in a way that i regret. just regret, no apology. another trump supporter, kathy miller, the county chair of the trump campaign in ohio had this to say about this situation. >> i don't think there was any racism until obama got elected. we've never had problems like this. you know, i'm in the real estate industry. there's none. now, you know, with the people with the guns and shooting up neighborhoods and not being responsible citizens, that's a big change. and i think that's the philosophy that obama has perpetuated on america. i think that's all his responsibility. and if you're black, and you haven't been successful in the last 50 years, it's your own fault. >> so mark thompson, no racism in america until 2008. that is in trump world.
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she, then, issued a written statement saying that her comes were inappropriate. she did not say they were wrong. >> champion right wing, alt-right troops is what we're hearing, those types of statements. they exacerbate the situation. we're always expected to talk about peace and being non-violent, and we should. but then people make those statementin statements, they make the situation worse. and they're following the leader, donald trump, this traveling with, he's got their travel really minstrel show in orange face doing more to divide black and white in this country. it's not helpful at all. >> and jonathan capehart, donald trump is reaching back to stop and frisk, which bill de blasio was on this network asnig nigla with rachel pointing out that after we stopped stop and frivgs
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in new york crime actually went down. >> donald trump is sort of all over the place when it comes to stop and frisk, criminal justice, outreach to african-americans. he is, i can't tell you what he actually believes in terms of any of these issues that we're talking about. and that second clip at ththat showed of that woman saying the most unbelievable things about racism and african-americans and successor ncess or not success kwan americ after -- after african-americans tells me there is such a divide with their fellow americans who happen to be black. there's no possible way that either of those two people could say what they said, believe what they believe, and then say it
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out loud if they actually knew people of color and knew african-americans in particular. >> mark thompson and jonathan capehart, thank you both for joining us tonight. really appreciate it. >> thank you. coming up, the police chief in charlotte has seen the video of the police shooting and has allowed the family of keith lamont scott to see that same video, but pressure continues tonight, as you heard from tremaine lee, to publicly release that video. no one speed... no one way of driving on each and every road. but there is one car that can conquer them all. the mercedes-benz c-class. five driving modes let you customize the steering, shift points, and suspension to fit the mood you're in... and the road you're on. the 2016 c-class. lease the c300 for $369 a month at your local mercedes-benz dealer.
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you're looking at live protests there on the screen in charlotte, north carolina. we're continuing to monitor the situation there. we will have more on the killing that sparked these protests. today keith lamont scott's family was allowed to watch the police dash cam and body cam videos that showed him being shot and killed. that's next.
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i did not see that in the videos that i reviewed. so what i can tell you, though, is when taken in the totality of all the other evidence, it supports what we've heard in the version of the truth that we gave about the circumstances at that happened that led to the death of mr. scott. >> and here's attorney for keith scott's family earlier tonight, having seen that video himself, speaking with nbc's gabe gutierrez. >> what did you see? >> well, let me start off by saying, it was painful to watch, not just to see him get shot and killed, but to see the reactions on his loved ones' faces. what i see in that video is an individual who was sitting in a car, who gets out in a calm, peaceful manner. he never appears aggressive. his hands are down. there does appear to be some object in his hand, but you can't make out what it is.
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at the moment he is shot, he's actually stepping backwards. >> did he have a gun? >> as far as i know, i don't know. we know that law enforcement is saying that he had a gun. i have not seen any definitive evidence, aside from what law enforcement is saying. >> joining us now, paul butler, law professor at georgetown university and former federal prosecutor, also with us, reverend william barber, president of the north carolina state conference of the naacp. reverend barber, have you been able to have any conversations with the mayor? i know we talked last night about the possibility you'd be having some meetings today on the issue of the video release. >> yes, indeed, thank you, r lawrence. i went and met with cler jans. they were black, white, jewish, christian people of all faiths. we met together, found out what was happening on the ground. we had a chance to sit with the
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attorney generalen of north carolina and speak with the mayor as well. we had a subsequent press conference. in unity, this is what the leadership is calling for, full release of the tape, full transparency. imagine if this was the other way around, a citizen shooting the cop. the tapes would no doubt be out. number two, a federal investigation and an independent investigation. number three, no curfew. we had worked that out. and i'm saddened to hear tonight that it has come back up because the moral leaders had asked for that. and also we found out that based on what the chief said, there were some body cameras that were not on the clergy said those people should be fired. if for any reason those body cameras were not on. this is the only way we're going to bring some, some sense of peace, because it has to be a peace with justice. right now we still have the same three scenarios. either a person was killed who did not have a gun and the police conspired to cover it up,
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either a person was killed who had a right to carry a gun but did not do anything aggressive, or a person had a gun and was aggressive and justifiably shot. but nobody knowing at this point, what occurred. >> it's quite striking that we have these two cases at almost the same time, in tulsa, oklahoma where the police did release video, including video from their helicopter, that showed clearly what was going on in that, and by the way, it was video that was very incriminating to the police, to the point now, that we have criminal charges against the officer who fired that shot. and then you have charlotte, where there's no video released. you have trouble in shar will the -- charlotte and calm in tulsa. >> it's about transparency and accountability. we've seen time and time again that video makes a difference. in chicago, the police sat on the video of laquan mcdonald being gunned down by the police
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for a year. when it was released, that cop was charged with murder in a week. tulsa did the right thing. they had the video. they didn't try to cover it up. they released it, two days later there's a manslaughter charge against that officer. at the end of the day, this is about democracy. if officers, armed agents of the state are going around shooting people when they're supposed to be serving and protecting, the people have a right to know why. we should demand the same accountability from cops as we do from other public officials. >> and professor butler, the police today cited your old employer, the justice department, saying the fbi is interested in looking at this case, and that's another reason to not show the video, to preserve the evidence, basically, privately, at this point while the possibility of a federal investigation develops. does that make sense to you? >> not at all. there's no law enforcement reason why a video that is available to the public should
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not be shown to the public. the fbi can look at it, just like everybody else, you know, i've worked with fbi agents for many years on many kinds of casing, and there's just no reason why they wouldn't want this video released. in fact, it undermines faith in the investigation when officials try to sit on evidence. it really does make it hook lloe a coverup. too many times we see a blue line, a thick blue line where police officers don't try to hold their own fellow cops to the same standards as other citizens, and that's just unacceptable. >> we have calm tonight in tulsa, and we have tension tonight in charlotte. is anyone making the case to the mayor, to the police chief there, that look at this, look at these two examples. they released the video in tulsa, it makes a difference. >> yeah, a number of things have been made. there's a whole group of clergy
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led by the local president and dr. sadler and others who are there. and they've made the case. they were up last night saying, listen, first of all lawrence, this country, black and white. the protesters are black and white. it's not just black and latino, are suffering daily, ongoing traumatic stress syndrome. you go to event, to event, to event. you can get killed with skittles, with a cd, sitting in your car, selling cigarettes. you can get killed agos a 12 ye old. that's too much pain. you're right. if we have the video, we should show the video, because we cannot continue to stand for what we call mpd -- murder by police. and you need to know what's going on. i guarantee you, that if that was the other way around and
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there was an officer of the law shot and there was a video to show that he was shot, the video would be out. the video would be out. i understand from my lawyers now, that even the family has said, it's time to release the video. >> reverend barber, what's your expectation in charlotte tonight at midnight when the curfew goes into effect? >> well, you know, it's exacerbating. i met with clergy today. they're actually out in the fields with yellow arm bands, 99.9% of the protesters have not been violent. this has not been charlotte burning. there's been a few provocateurs, but when you put in place a curfew, that only exacerbates. i'm thinking about wisconsin. remember when they had the long protest in wisconsin? people stayed in the state capital for a week. our governor is a governor who actually has signed a law to hold back videos coming before the public, and it's public
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record. we own it. to add to that a curfew, to add to that the national guard. to add to that militarization, rather than putting all of this emphasis and trying to stifle legitimate discontent and non-violent protests, certainly, there's been one person killed. we don't in any way support violence. but to do that now is to continue to stir. our focus should be on releasing those tapes, independent federal investigation, dealing with those cops that did not have their body cameras on. that should be the focus now. >> thank you both for join beins tonight. >> we'll be right back.
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amphibian. male teacher: excellent. welcome to a brighter future. comcast. we're continuing to follow this situation in charlotte tonight, ahead of a midnight curfew. joining us now, nbc's gabe gutierrez. gabe? >> reporter: just a few seconds ago, and he's been telling me about this midnight curfew. they can do this all night. they haven't seen any situation that's gotten out of control.
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[ inaudible ] we were standing by the other side of this overpass for a few minutes. we're standing by on the other side of this overpass, and now they moved over here. so it's kind of hard to hear. it's loud over here, but it has been very peaceful. this officer says that people were even getting up onto the freeway and trying to block traffic, but they immediately came off. other than be being very loud, it wasn't much of a tense situation. but in speaking to this officer, he did say, they've been given orders, if it stays peaceful like this, they don't intend to clash with protesters at midnight as long as it stays peaceful. this is going to continue. this is from downtown. some of these protesters have tried to block traffic, but other than that, nothing like you saw last night.
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>> thanks for that report. we'll be right back. constipated?
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we're continuing to monitor the situation in charlotte tonight, and we have new reports today, about how donald trump is enriching himself from his campaign. and course those reports come after david fahrenthold's report that he has illegally used the charitable funds in the donald trump foundation. >> of course it is illegal to use the charity's money to benefit yourself or your businesses. are you concerned at all that trump may have broken the law? >> no, and i would point out in the second paragraph of that, that story that you mentioned, erin, it says "may have." and later on in the is story it says the irs may want to look at it. >> of course kellyanne conway has no idea whether the irs is investigating donald trump's
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illegal use of campaign funds to pay legal debts. and it was in that second paragraph, as kellyanne conway pointed out that david fahrenthold said trump quote may have violated laws. end quote. that's the phrase that the trump campaign now clings to in that article. and when a campaign manager's defense of a candidate is he may have vie olated laws as opposedo definitely violated laws, you know that candidate is in trouble. we have reporting by ken vogel about how much donald trump and his advertisers have been paid by the trump campaign, using other people's money, of course, including payments received by the trump campaign from the united states government. ken vogel reporting that the secret service has paid donald trump $1.6 million to fly on his plane with him. to protect him. it is standard procedure for the
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secret service to pay campaigns for flying on campaign planes, but this is the first time the secret service has been paying to fly on a campaign plane that is in effect owned by the candidate. and politico has identified another $8 million that the trump campaign has paid donald trump and his various businesses. joining us now, ken vogel, he's the author of the new book, "the making of donald trump ". david will try to look surprised. what you've found in the financing of the trump campaign and how much of that money getting paid to trump companies. >> yeah, it's really an unprecedented intermingling of a candidate's business and political operations. typically, when you have a wealthy candidate. and it's like the more wealthy the candidate, the more cautious they are about keeping those two
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spheres separate, because they're concerned that it might give rise to allegations of self-dealing. i'm thinking of a steve forbes or michael broom beloomberg or romney where they went to great lengths separate. but using the campaign as a platform to promote the business. we've seen his hotel in washington, d.c. and mira lago. and promoting trump steaks and trump water. this has increased kear concern he would be like as a president. >> and donald trump has famously said in the past he thought he could be the only person who could make money by running for president. >> yes, keep in mind that what
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may happen, if donald is elected, we may see a sign held out at the oval office, available for paid appearances. >> and as to the irs violation on the use of charitable funds, the way he has done that. it seems to me, without question, this will trigger a formal investigation as to how he's handled that money by the irs in terms of how he has handled that trump foundation. >> a couple of the eight known misuses of funds he may be able to wiggle out of, but clearly there's been self-dealing here, and keep in mind how little trump gives. mien ky ecolumn points out the n give away rate versus trump's give away rate. the clintons donate at 1,000 times donald trump. if you accept donald trump's assertions, they give away 37
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times the rate that donald trump gives away. and their giving isn't self-interested. its biggest gifts go to places like the prep school where his son goes to school. and other charities that tie right back into his self-interests. >> it could be that donald trump has given zero of his money to charity in the last seven years. so i don't know how to calculate how far the clintons are or any of us sitting here are to donald trump on charitable giving. >> you look at the amount that's being taken in, the amount being spent, including the potential violations and the potential self-dealing, it's really penny ante stuff. if you are really that wealthy,
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you don't need that money to buy paintings or settle legal disputes. >> thank you. we're going back to charlotte now to msnbc's tremaine lee. what is happening now? >> reporter: about 15 minutes ago, about 300 protesters took the 16 south highway. they were here about two minutes and police moved in in riot gear. then you hear the rubber bullets firing off then it was tear gas and pepper spray. eyes burning. the helicopter is above us. there are still a number of protesters above us. the police have fallen back. for a while, there was a stretch across the highway. but now the police have taken
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back the highway. it looks like they have -- yeah, there are still dozens here. can you see missi you can see police officers trying to get back into formation. it has calmed down, but minutes aa ago it was pure chaos as police tried to retake the highway. >> is this an area where the police expected the protesters to go? >> reporter: i'll tell you what, lawrence. we've been marching the better part of an hour or two hours. and you didn't really see any police until we came by the stadium, the panther stadium. then you saw about a dozen officers on bicycles. protesters were trying to get up on the overpass. one protester said they're waiting for us, it's a setup. you come down and see the flashing lights. maybe a couple state troopers on the other side. the protesters decided to take the highway.
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despite the presence of police. moments later, the sound of rubber bullets bouncing offer the ground. people running back up the hill to the overpass. you can still smell the smoke in the air. but it's relative calm. again, for a while, they allowed the protesters to march relatively unencumbered, but it had been a peaceful march until, until, you know, the police started firing rubber bullets. whether they anticipated it or not, it seemed to be well played, again. for a long time, protesters were allowed to move throughout the community. as you can see down here, let's take a rolook down here, the police officers are again getting in formation. a lot of protesters moving back up the hill. they're facing us now. some people are saying let's move, they're coming up the hill, but as of right now, they're standing in formation.
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protesters are standingen firm. >> was this road already closed to protesters before they got there? >> there was no traffic. but on the other side, those police cars had already blocked that side of the highway, and there was no travgs at all coming this way. there was no police presence on this side in terms of the vehicle, flashing lights, just the protesters throughout the evening we did see officers going the opposite direction as protesters. this may have been a planned operation. kind of the idea of not, you know, putting the protesters in a position where they had to fight back, draw that line. so many times when police officers draw that lighne in th sand they're met with protesters. >> is there any leader of this moment?
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when these protesters moved to this place, is there any person or group of people who led them to that place who can now suggest an alternative to them? >> reporter: it seems relatively organic. i don't know if there was any planning behind the scenes. there didn't seem to be any leader. at different points, someone would stand on top of a trash can and say something about unity and peace. they would go outside the jail to lead chanting. at different points, you would say let's make a left, let's make a right. but it didn't seem to be a real leader. the police are lining up in formation. it appears that they may be preparing to take this hill. ago y as you see protesters coming back up the hill. they're pushing many protesters offer of the highway back on this side of the exit. police are relatively quiet.
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they're coming back up the hill from the highway. relatively quiet. not much chanting, not much noise at all. >> we're going to stay with your camera position, and i'm going to add jim cavanaugh to the conversation. >> reporter: lawrence, they're making a move up the hill now. >> okay. >> and tremaine, what is the crowd's reaction? >> reporter: they're moving relatively slowly. the police are slowly marching in formation. a group of protesters had marched up the hill. this is a major highway. this is panther stadium. bank of america stadium is right there. police are in formation. it's still relatively calm. the crowd really hasn't responded in any kind of way at all besides following
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directions. they're moving up the hill, away from the highway. relatively seamless, it's not that chaotic scene that we've seen 15, 20 minutes ago. >>what is your estimate about how many protesters are at that location? >> reporter: at this point, i would say maybe 250 people. yeah, maybe 250 people. behind me, maybe 100 people are going away from the highway to the side streets. but still clinging to this hill, right along the highway. there might be 250 people. it's kind of quiet besides the whir of the helicopter above me. i am not sure if you can hear the sound. it's quiet.
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>> everything you're saying is corroborated by what we can hear and see on your video. i want to add, if we can, jim cavanaugh to our conversation, tremaine, so he can give us his analysis as a law enforcement analyst of the tactics that he's seeing there on that road. jim cavanaugh, what do you make of what you're seeing of the police movements here? >> well, the police, obviously, have taken the highway, looks like the interstate highway divided with a cement barrier with their line. it's all obvious to us that highways present a danger to civilians who could be on that, you know, on foot. nevertheless, they've shut down the highway. both ways. you can see, there's no traffic but the police. but they've decided to make that a line, not to let the people on the highway. now we don't know the reason for that, lawrence, it may be that they want police and ambulance and other vehicles to be able to move up and do you knwn that hi.
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that could be a main artery for emergency vehicles, and it's a place they don't have to contend. i doubt they're going to try to push up the hill. it looks like they're trying to keep the highway static. >> tremaine, tell us what the situation is now. >> reporter: are you guys there? police are moving up the hill. police are moving up the hill, firing rubber bullets, there is some gas. we were standing on that hill, overlooking the highway. police have now taken the hill. firing rubber bullets. there's some gas. everyone moments ago scattered. look beyond me. you can see, you can see the lineup of state troopers have taken the hill. everyone, the 200 or so people i talked about are now up on the street. police have formed a line. they fired a few lines of rubber bullets. there's still gas in the air, smoke in the air. everyone's moving back now.
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>> tremaine, how far are you from that position were you in at the highway? >> reporter: about 45 yards. >> okay. >> reporter: and, again, after the rounden eof rubber bullets they are marching away from the highway. >> all of that crowd moved back as the mission moved in? >> they certainly all scattered. that was followed by rubber bullets. a round or two of rubber bullets. and i'm not sure if tear gas or pepper spray. it choking youes you a little b. but it's not the burning of the lungs that would accompany tear gas. as soon as they started marching, folks started running. same tactic on the highway. formation, make their presence known, as people are running away, that's when they start
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firing rubber bulletinsbullets. do you know what they aim at? >> the rubber bullets, everyone was running. >> it's not between black and white. >> reporter: brother, appreciate it. people are hanging tight even as rubber bullets are firing. the police are marching and still firing rubber bullets at the crowd. >> it's when you shoot tear gas at us! >> reporter: as you see -- i'm not sure if you can hear the ping of rubber bullets. can you hear the sound of the rubber bullets firing, and now despite the mission comipolice police have taken oev south
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church and west moorehead, setting up a line across west moorehead. other police vehicles, and a police van are blocking the other side of west moorehead. now the bulk of the protesters have moved up further away from this highway. not sure the direction we've moved in terms of north, south, east or west, but the bulk of the crowd has moved. there are some hangers on, many with cameras, media, clearly. and the police have again, set up with their shields, their batons. completely have taken over the highway, completely have taken over the hill where 200, 250 protesters had gathered. it's kind of a quiet moment. in the background, someone's playing music, sounds like michael jackson, belying this extreme nature of what down minutes ago. protesters scattering, the sound of rubber bulleting pinging offer the ground. but we've seen this time and
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again. there will be a lull. police will march forward, protesters will scatter. at this location there are only a few dozen. the rest have scattered further up the hill. we can look in the background and see the bulk, the body of the protesters have sense moved -- sink moved ce moved up the . >> does this seem to be the order they would use to keep peop people off the highway. >> reporter: until about an hour ago, they had let protesters march freely. the epicenter was the omni hotel where that young man suffered a
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fatal injury last night and where the bulk of the protest was. but now that the police have pushed everyone back but a few groups of media, it looks like maybe a few hangers on in terms of protesters, they're holding that position, pushing folks into the downtown part of the city or towards that direction. again, it's still relatively quiet. this area, they're across west moorehead, i'm sorry, south church and west moorehead. but the bulk of the crowd has moved this direction. maybe we should follow this group. they're cresting a little bit. so it's hard to see the bulk of them. but, again, quiet. police still holding strong, police vehicles blocking this street. watch out, we have a car behind us. you can see also up in the air, there's a police helicopter keeping a close watch on this group of protesters. the body of the protesters. again, par for the course for this evening. perhaps a tactic. perhaps they've learned when you
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draw that line you're forced to encounter protesters. now, still, we're about 11:00 now, an hour away from curfew. earlier there was a young man who stood in the center of the crowd and said if you're scared of the police maybe you should go home, and, again, that is what's going to come down to. at it 12:00, how many will stand strong? one person said we're not going anywhere, so we'll see, lawrence. >> have you seen any evidence that the police would be prepared to transport basically what would be mass arrests? when we get to midnight, if there are a lot of people still on the street? >> reporter: not so far, lawrence. that's been the thing. police until this point have been relatively incognito. very little presence, except for a couple dozen police officers
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on bicycles when we got to bank of america stadium. outside the nascar hall of fame, you saw a bunch of national guards in humvees. the epicenter of last night's protest, there was a humvee and a few national guards men, but again, relatively quiet. even now, you don't see, down towards the highway you see the police presence. but out here, where there have been hundreds of protesters marching away from the highway, i don't see any protesters, besides the ones keeping watch which have now disappeared down another side street. but, again, this may well have been part of the plan. allow protesters a little room, not suffocate the situation, not force this body of protesters that so far hasn't been angry, certainly energized, but a far cry from what we saw last night. but it only takes one false move, one errant plastic bottle to spark things off, or from the police. if they make one wrong move in
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terming of drawing that line, we see how the protesters respond. tonight the police rather seamlessly took back the hay way, utilizing rubber bullets, some gas, but, using some gas, but relatively quiet. you didn't hear any sirens, no commands from a bullhorn. as of right now, the scene is, again, relatively quiet. >> jermaine lee reporting live from charlotte. we now continue our live coverage with brian williams. >> lawrence, thank you, this is indeed what would normally be our broadcast of "the 11th hour" for the second straight night. instead of covering the presidential campaign we are indeed covering large protests in the streets of charlotte, north carolina. thankfully, as tre'maine lee has been talking about, none of the violence we saw in that city.


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